Curse

Secksy · Oct 25, 2008, 12:57 AM // 00:57

Wow, the mesmer has my favorite bar. >_>

HawkofStorms · Oct 25, 2008, 01:22 AM // 01:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

that'd be tru if u based tier's on the build quality...

but if u based em on match-ups in a costume brawl fight, they'd look more like this:

imba = ranger
top = ele, rit, monk
mid = war, derv, sin, nec
bottom = para, mes

war definatelly has a good bar...
but when it comes down to it
its bout match-ups
and he gets out-matched in too many 1vs1 situtations

on the other hand, nec has a horrible bar...
but is the -only- class that can reliably neutralize a ranger

Agreed. 100% People need to remember its not like these builds are going up against a top rated GvG team. They are going up against each other.

As such, they work fairly well.

The monk's bar is effective in this game type, and if they had made a true WoH style monk build, it would be RIDICULOUSLY overpowered in the game type for no one would get any kills, the games would drag on, and become like actually Hero Battles whereall people do is cap. NO ONE should want that to happen because we can all agree the HB blows.

Zera Fang · Oct 25, 2008, 01:57 AM // 01:57

Maybe I'm alone in this, but I honestly think this event could be about a million times better. Woo hoo? You get to play as a henchie with a predetermined bar, fun. I mean, if the bar was built out of skills that you couldn't normally use, yeah, it would be entertaining, like Christmas with all the snowball skills... But, no. You're forced to play with a bar that caters some classes over others, get to cap shrines, and get to deal with all the garbage that is late loaders and people that don't even know what the hell is going on. Why didn't they implement something new like Zombies, Vampire, Pumpkin Head, and Werewolf classes with special skills? Could this event be worse? Yes, everyone could have Echo Mending Frenzy on their bar, but that's about it...

DarkNecrid · Oct 25, 2008, 02:03 AM // 02:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

Quit knocking on the monk build.

I soloed a nub sin that ganked me (KD + Smite Hex / condition FTW), and I soloed an elly by spamming reversal of damage.

I had a 16 win streak in a 2 monk team, but my internet got major laggy and I lost connection

The monk rules.

Hint on how to play the monk - Use the signets, play offensively, place your smites where they are going to cause damage, and keep your team buffed with Vig Spirit / Healing Breeze when needed.

If by rules, you mean, has no mobility needed to win the game type, does subpar damage compared to even the freaking Mesmer, and has the worst self healing compared to every other class, then yes, it does rule. His only pro is Smite Hex, and it's on a 12s recharge that won't help you much if they have more than 1 hexer. It's other people healing is also subpar since its the same as his self heal. (And yes, all this is neccessary to keep the game type working, so the Monk will always suck. I get that.)

The Monk bar is effective vs random people who don't even know what a split is, and I can win 10 times in RA with 4 skills on a Monk bar

but I think (rather: hope) we both know that isn't any "good".

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

that'd be tru if u based tier's on the build quality...

but if u based em on match-ups in a costume brawl fight, they'd look more like this:

imba = ranger
top = ele, rit, monk
mid = war, derv, sin, nec
bottom = para, mes

war definatelly has a good bar...
but when it comes down to it
its bout match-ups
and he gets out-matched in too many 1vs1 situtations

on the other hand, nec has a horrible bar...
but is the -only- class that can reliably neutralize a ranger

I was counting matchups and versus each other. The warrior is really good. The warrior is outmatched in matchups in the real game too (every class can shut one down), it doesn't make it any less not the best class in the game. The Warrior is the most effective melee out of the 3 (Sin requires a Hex to do his full combo and has to wait if he's blind, Dervish has no disruption needed to really get kills quick.), but you have to be smart and take advantage of openings and weaknesses.

Also the Assassin can reliably neutralize the Ranger as well. HC negates their IMS & block, and Iron Palm disrupts their only self heal.

Dr.Jones · Oct 25, 2008, 02:31 AM // 02:31

the para bar is rather week.

Mr. Undisclosed · Oct 25, 2008, 02:34 AM // 02:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zera Fang

Maybe I'm alone in this, but I honestly think this event could be about a million times better. Woo hoo? You get to play as a henchie with a predetermined bar, fun. I mean, if the bar was built out of skills that you couldn't normally use, yeah, it would be entertaining, like Christmas with all the snowball skills... But, no. You're forced to play with a bar that caters some classes over others, get to cap shrines, and get to deal with all the garbage that is late loaders and people that don't even know what the hell is going on. Why didn't they implement something new like Zombies, Vampire, Pumpkin Head, and Werewolf classes with special skills? Could this event be worse? Yes, everyone could have Echo Mending Frenzy on their bar, but that's about it...

Tbh that is a terrible idea and sounds extremely lame. I like it the way it is, like ra except your team mate's skill bars are guarenteed to be semi decent.

Alleji · Oct 25, 2008, 02:38 AM // 02:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

imba = ranger
top = ele, rit, monk
mid = war, derv, sin, nec
bottom = para, mes

war definatelly has a good bar...
but when it comes down to it
its bout match-ups
and he gets out-matched in too many 1vs1 situtations

on the other hand, nec has a horrible bar...
but is the -only- class that can reliably neutralize a ranger

I wouldn't put ranger as the best. It has to be either ele or rit.

Rit is ridiculously resilient. Need 3 people to kill him, or a good mes/lucky ranger. (I had some people interrupt me through warding like it wasn't there...) Meanwhile rit also puts out some damage and doesn't run out of energy.

Ele just owns anything 1v1, except rit, who can outlast. Can't take on multiple people like the rit because you can only keep one reliably controlled, but in group vs group fights, ele is one of the best in damage AND utility.

Warrior gets owned hardcore by blind and cripple, but if you have a monk to smite conditions, it's a good bar and it kills shit. Which is what warriors do. So if you're alone, it heavily depends on the matchup, but with a monk war+monk are one of the best combos. (Other than pulling conditions/hexes, monk is pretty shitty. Does less damage than the rit, has a knockdown and two bad heals.)

IMO:

Good: Rit, Ele, Ranger
Ok: Warrior, Mesmer, Sin
Not-so-good: Derv, Monk
Go play something else: Necro, Para

Krill · Oct 25, 2008, 02:51 AM // 02:51

How about making it so you don't have to rearrange your skills every single time in costume brawl...lawl. Suppose this goes with the theme of playing GW by rolling your face on the keyboard, maybe it's a trick...or a treat. ^_^

I agree that the ranger and rit are probably the best classes this year, Melandru's Shot is really good.

xDusT II · Oct 25, 2008, 02:58 AM // 02:58

Tremendously laggy. Nuff said.

The games I played were mildly entertaining but it's only really fun when your playing with synced teams who know what their doing. There's a lot of strategy and movement necessary that the average team can't be expected to know, hence making it quite frustrating.

Also, I just lagged out about 5 times in a row, finally got a game, lagged out, came back with dishonourable and decided this was bullshit and quit. I feel sorry for the people who are going to have to play in the mAT under these conditions.

Perfected Shadow · Oct 25, 2008, 03:21 AM // 03:21

85k ms woot.

dr love · Oct 25, 2008, 04:09 AM // 04:09

why so much necro hate? having 1 necro on ur team is awesome. he neutralizes P, R, W, D, A... thats pretty fraggin good. its just those damn Rts that seem impossible to kill

snaek · Oct 25, 2008, 04:10 AM // 04:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alleji

Ele just owns anything 1v1, except rit, who can outlast. Can't take on multiple people like the rit because you can only keep one reliably controlled, but in group vs group fights, ele is one of the best in damage AND utility.

ranger pwns ele in this

aside from +100al vs ele dmg
ele has 1s and 2s casts which r very easy to interrupt
and even if he misses interupt on either goi or steam
his antidote signet recharges much faster than his steam does

Quote:

Originally Posted by darknecrid

I was counting matchups and versus each other. The warrior is really good. The warrior is outmatched in matchups in the real game too (every class can shut one down), it doesn't make it any less not the best class in the game. The Warrior is the most effective melee out of the 3 (Sin requires a Hex to do his full combo and has to wait if he's blind, Dervish has no disruption needed to really get kills quick.), but you have to be smart and take advantage of openings and weaknesses.

matchups tend to give the advantage to the defensive bar
war can potentially output the most dmg
but derv has cripple which covers the bleeding, which covers the dw (ws > evis in costume brawls)
the advantage of the sin is his ranged snare (build is missing dash tho)

Quote:

Originally Posted by darknecrid

Also the Assassin can reliably neutralize the Ranger as well. HC negates their IMS & block, and Iron Palm disrupts their only self heal.

iron palm recharges too long
a good ranger will be able to interupt combo
or even the 1s cast hidden caltrops hex
oh..and if all that fails...removing dw and poison from a single cast of antidote signet will keep em alive

Productivity · Oct 25, 2008, 04:31 AM // 04:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbulger

why so much necro hate? having 1 necro on ur team is awesome. he neutralizes P, R, W, D, A... thats pretty fraggin good. its just those damn Rts that seem impossible to kill

Because anyone with half a decent idea will just ignore the thing and cap something else. It's a 5v5 character in a format where if you're in a bad matchup you just go do something else.

The assassin is decent but only because HC is such good movement control. In a 1on1 all the decent classes should easily beat it. The ranger should D shot one of the leads and s shot the other, the ele should have it blinded, the Rt can survive it easily enough with WoW and wielders and the warrior just has to shieldbash the twisting fangs.

garethporlest18 · Oct 25, 2008, 04:41 AM // 04:41

I was using the monk and with the team I had it was working pretty well. The Necro would be good in certain matchups. Had one on my team who died 1 time I think while tanking things out of 5 matches. Warrior I didn't like much. Rit is really nice, had fun with that. Mesmer and Paragon I didn't bother with. Ele was okay same with Sin. Ranger is decent but not all the time.

The Meth · Oct 25, 2008, 05:50 AM // 05:50

Mesmer vs anything but monk = win for Mesmer in under 15 seconds. Monks can usually keep going for a while if they cancel cast healing breeze and get it off a few times, but they almost never do. Every other caster = dead in under 10 seconds, physical = useless vs empathy without condition removal. Ranger can be hard if you are unable to dodge the arrows while casting, which not many players can do.

Most the builds are pretty good though, I would say it goes like this:

Top: Mesmer, Monk, Ranger
All Good 1v1 most of the other classes, and are very powerful in larger battles.
Middle: Warrior, Dervish, Assassin, Elementalist, Ritualist
The melees are partially gimped because the game is about ganking, can't gank as well when your attacks are melee. Ele and Rit both are powerful in team matchups, but rather weak is a number of 1v1s. These all work very well paired up with one another or with a top tier class, which can cover their weaknesses.
Bottom: Necromancer, Paragon
Necro is just plain outclassed by everything else, paragons will forever be weak in any format that promotes 1v1s and 2v2s

IMO, best team would contain 1 Mesmer (strongly counters every class, very good for soloing shrines/displaced enemies., 1 Monk (conditio/hex removal, knockdowns, healing), 1 Assassin (excellent ganking and quicking finishing running enemies.), 1 Ranger (high degen and interrupts do well vs 5v5s and most casters, the cripple lets it take down melee's), and 1 of whatever else, probably another mesmer or assassin.

Did about 90 battles tonight, only lost twice when someone had to leave and it was a 4v5. 75% of it is good teamwork though. Control the shrine buffs (especially battle shrine) and gank people dumb enough not to see the dots on the map surrounding them. As long as you hold battle shrine you have the mobility advantage, you can run away from any fight you don't like and get into the ones you want.

If this was a real competitive format the balance would be much different, but as it is its pretty much about getting into fights with people who dont realize they have no chance with certain class matchups, then doing it 19 more times.

AKB48 · Oct 25, 2008, 05:52 AM // 05:52

Haha, just played with a 3 monk+1dev+1 ranger team. Got 25 games in a row, pretty good lol I like monking=D

FlamingMetroid · Oct 25, 2008, 05:53 AM // 05:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

mid = sin

DOHOHO
almost had me there for a second

Alleji · Oct 25, 2008, 06:56 AM // 06:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbulger

why so much necro hate? having 1 necro on ur team is awesome. he neutralizes P, R, W, D, A... thats pretty fraggin good.

Ele does it better (except on rangers), in addition to doing way more damage and snaring stuff. Necro is just a bad bar... I think anet just way overrated draw conditions/plague sig combo and thought it would somehow carry the template.

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

ranger pwns ele in this

aside from +100al vs ele dmg
ele has 1s and 2s casts which r very easy to interrupt
and even if he misses interupt on either goi or steam
his antidote signet recharges much faster than his steam does

Line of sight.

Yeah, I'm guessing a good ranger would kill me. I just haven't been fortunate enough to run into one in ~3 hours of playing this. (lol RA, rite?) Hell, half of them don't even have a brain to use antidote sig. They just troll at half health and think they'll survive or something.

germanturkey · Oct 25, 2008, 08:08 AM // 08:08

yeah, mesmers can pretty much shut down everything. ele can take down pretty much any other class.

bhavv · Oct 25, 2008, 08:09 AM // 08:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkNecrid

If by rules, you mean, has no mobility needed to win the game type blah blah blah blah blah .....

....

Quote:

Originally Posted by AKB48

Haha, just played with a 3 monk+1dev+1 ranger team. Got 25 games in a row, pretty good lol I like monking=D

Yea, some other people just never learned how to play smite, their loss. If you dont know how to play a smite monk, dont knock it, the only thing bad about this monk build is the player behind it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alleji

Ele just owns anything 1v1, except rit, who can outlast.

Explain to me how I soloed an elly spamming his shatterstone bar on my monk???

Reversal of Damage - Spam it through healing breeze + vig spirit, use your signets, smite the hexes and conditions, anything including ellys and rangers die from ganking you. The monk can survive everything while killing his attacker. The only time it fails is when you are being hit by 3+ people, of course, that is exactly what a full WoH healer build is designed to last against.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkNecrid

His only pro is Smite Hex, and it's on a 12s recharge that won't help you much if they have more than 1 hexer.

(Smite condition - 7s recharge, Healing Breeze + Vig Spirit covers Degen extremely well and pushes red bars up along wit RoD spam).

Riptose monk in RA is actually a good build idea for that particular game, considering that everyone attacks you. Dish out some damage back to them, and watch the people ganking you die. I also use Whirlwind + Tenais Wind sometimes on my monk, they are epic lifesavers.

Of course, the elitist GVG'ers and HA'ers are going to knock on anything that doesnt use their - Spike in 2 seconds to kill, Infuse or die - rule.